27 replies to this topic

[jayhelen]

Now you see this is why I like this forum so many views all very relevant

Some points made by professionals so far

Other property available
Yes, apply for the mortgage on the predicted salary showing no actual income, when refused it’s a mute point

Yes ask to rent house offer £50 a week to show you are actually trying and taking on board their report’s findings

Ask the highways department if they are happy with a very very large tractor and very large trailer or muck spreader???? Being manoverd through the housing estate wilst children play 6 times a day?

Ask the fire brigade if parked on road as a taxed vehicle they could get past in an emergency!!!!!!!!!!!!! And who would be liable for a time delay leading to death as you instructed to use the accommodation and need your expensive equipment near to try and prevent theft

Travelling to and from means lack of security on site and not very green

Get a letter from a vet or animal health asking for a time limit on acting on a distressed animal?

Go and apply for council house

Ask the rspca if they would prefer you to be on hand with your animals or a 16 mim walk away ( as you cant re home a cat if you go out to work and leve it at home by its self as in there opinion its not in the welfare of the animal )

Yes ill get a letter from a butcher

He also did not mention the hay we sold for £4800 vey convenant

I’ll listen for more?

[Groundhog]

Please remember that we are following the F2F route - there is no way our current business would be growing the way it is if it were not for the fact that we are using a 'caravan' as accommodation whilst carrying out building and engineering works!

To go back though to our original suggestion, our concern is that councils will start refusing temp planning permissions, to those who for one reason or another cannot follow the F2F route, because too often the original applicants cash in on the permission even though it is only temporary. You KC are one of the exceptions.

Our concern for Jayhelen is that because of Copley Wood (which they actually mention as having provided training regarding pigs), they will be refused temp permission because the council will not trust them to follow their submitted business plan but will sell the parcel of land at its enhanced price.

Your concern about councils refusing temp permissions who cannot follow the field to farm route makes it sound like LPA's are advocating this route,anyway it is built around PPS7 which is a gov policy.I also dont think KC is the exception.You havent answered my question relating how long you intend to follow the F2F route is it the full 5 years ?

[Groundhog]

Now you see this is why I like this forum so many views all very relevant

Some points made by professionals so far

Other property available
Yes, apply for the mortgage on the predicted salary showing no actual income, when refused it’s a mute point

Yes ask to rent house offer £50 a week to show you are actually trying and taking on board their report’s findings

Ask the highways department if they are happy with a very very large tractor and very large trailer or muck spreader???? Being manoverd through the housing estate wilst children play 6 times a day?

Ask the fire brigade if parked on road as a taxed vehicle they could get past in an emergency!!!!!!!!!!!!! And who would be liable for a time delay leading to death as you instructed to use the accommodation and need your expensive equipment near to try and prevent theft

Travelling to and from means lack of security on site and not very green

Get a letter from a vet or animal health asking for a time limit on acting on a distressed animal?

Go and apply for council house

Ask the rspca if they would prefer you to be on hand with your animals or a 16 mim walk away ( as you cant re home a cat if you go out to work and leve it at home by its self as in there opinion its not in the welfare of the animal )

Yes ill get a letter from a butcher

He also did not mention the hay we sold for £4800 vey convenant

I’ll listen for more?

Your comment on hay I think is worth expanding on maybe part of the business could be to supply high quality fodder ie haylage for racehorses that is made to specific requirements ie protein d.value levels and tested for listeria and sold at a premium,a specialist product.
Such a product in large bales can retail in excess of £40 per bale.you should be able to gross margin £25 a bale if you cut and turn yourself

[jayhelen]

up dates planning commite on the 12 th

have a read if of any help to anyone

jason

Attached Files

•  Agricultural Appraisal 2 (Bruton Knowles).pdf   59.46KB   19 downloads
•  Responce to Bruton Knowles Report (New Land Owner).pdf   26.26KB   24 downloads

[KChally]

I think that is a brilliant response by NLO. Bruton Knowles shot down in flames!!

KChally

[surreydodger]

Hi Jay and Helen,

It's a bit tricky to give some concise replies to the above as I'm ot fully conversant with all of the previous correspndence but taking what I can see, it seems the Bruton Knowles reply lacks much effort or work in providing factual evidence to substantiate their points.

Notably, their third paragraph, 'In this case ,,,,,,,,,,,' falls solely upon 'in our view'. The scale of a business should have no real effect on the welfare of animals. Be it one or a thousand, all animals warrant the same respect and attention for it's well being and health. Not that, that important part washes highly with Planning Inspectors,, who are neither an animal or farmer themselves so in reality can not bring to bear any real experience or skill in determining welfare issues.

Bruton Knowles view is that a response time if up to 10 minutes would be adequate. I would ask them on what evidence and factual information do they use to conclude ten minutes is okay? Why not five minutes,, why not fifteen minutes??? Surely the answer from the welfare of the animal must be to be on hand in the absolute minimum time viable? If you can be on hand within two minutes to attend a sick animal or any such duty requiring your immediate attention, then it surely falls that it must be cruel to let that animal endure distress for longer, un-necessarily.

In paragraph 2, Bruton Knowles suggest that living 'nearby' is practicle and it is not necessary to live within sight and sound of the stock. PPS7 does not define 'nearby' so nearby could mean right on the farm or ,,, 'nearby' ,,, and as we don't know what 'nearby' means legally, it is up for debate. I would allude back to my above paragraph that 'nearby' means that you are as close as posible to provide the earliest and best support.

Regarding CCTV. I do appreciate that CCTV may be fitted and allow one to monitor anyting one chooses from any random point in the world. However, is it fair to expect one to pay out for such equipment and services on top of paying for a house away from the farm site. This is an additional expense that can be avoided if one lives on site. There is also then the additioanl problem that assuming the surveillance system is carried by the internet or phone line that those two services are not gauranteed to be availabe 100% of the time. Sure, the downtime from such services is very small,, probably less that 1% but which 1% it would be is not predictable. If a planner is happy to gamble that the 1% or so of CCTV downtime won't ever intrude on your business or cause a loss, then perhaps they would be happy to cover any loss so arising.

All in all. Bruton Knowles are probably on a very tight budget looking at the way they are replying and that should allow you opportunities to discredit the statements they are writing.

Good luck with it all
SD

[KChally]

here, here !!!

[jayhelen]

well here we go

yesterday at the nfdc planning commite our application was refused !!! no real shock in its self

but we did take some consalation in the fact that it was

7 votes to refuse

7 votes to allow

the chair had casting vote and as with most they voted in planning officers favor

so rejecting our application now we will wait and see what happens in the next 28 days

any one been in this situation

jason