7 replies to this topic

[justmeagain]

Hi, We'd be grateful for advice

 

After 2 years looking for suitable land we've found nearly 20 acres of agricultural land in our area and put in an offer  (in the home counties so like looking for the proverbial needle). It has an existing agricultural access with farm gate, with access onto a C road. Questions are:

 

1) At what stage is visibility assessed? We plan to build a Barn first using PD rights, then to apply for temp planning for an agricultural dwelling (both after establishing the need). From what I've read, the access splays are not mentioned on PD for the barn but would be a consideration for temporary planning permission, is that correct?

 

2) How strictly or otherwise are visibility requirements applied?  the splays on this land are shorter than the standard

 

3) Has anyone had a traffic speed survey done, and if so was it successful?

 

4) If other existing sites in the area have reduced visibility splays does this set a precedent?

 

Thanks for any help

 

Just

 

[bramblebasher]

I think you need 250 metres clear view on a 60 road, thats going from memory so do check. 

 

I put in an application for a new, safer, entrance to my farm as the original one is insanely dangerous. Highways advised against as there was only 150m visibility on the new one, vs 20m on the old! However the Planners adopted a very pragmatic stance on the matter and passed the application. The were going to turn it down until I asked them to put it in writing that they feel the current access is safe enough for farm gate sales. 

 

Yes highways will be consulted on your temp dwelling app, if there's not 250m clear view, and it cannot be improved, you may need to offer a common sense reason why that is not a material planning consideration. As every case is different and must be assessed on its own merits, it is not possible to advise further. 

 

Have fun, 20 acres is more than enough. 

[bramblebasher]

By the way in answer to your question number 4) the answer is no. They will assess the case on its own merits. 

[justmeagain]

Thanks for the reply    That leads to  another related question.  If the access is already in use for a barn and agricultural business, is a dwelling regarded as leading to more traffic movements or less? (bearing in mind that no one can second guess the planners, but if anyone has had a similar it would be great to hear). 

[Greenbeast]

You might have to argue there wouldn't be a significant increase in traffic. Probably fine for a single dwelling, but difficult for a farm shop

We pointed out during our PP for our temp dwelling that we were already driving on and off  the land several times a day to farm it....

[bramblebasher]

Exactly as ye ode Beast says, the dwelling will lead to a reduction in car journeys. They may counter by saying that it'll mean more visits from friends and relatives, you would need to deal with that, there are ways and means but I'm not going into that publicly.

 

Unless you argue otherwise it'll be assumed the dwelling will lead to an increase in traffic as per paragraph 55 of NPPF, this is one of the MAIN reasons the Government seek to limit new dwellings in the countryside i.e. unsustainable travel patterns.

 

You have to be ahead of that.

[justmeagain]

Thanks for taking the time to reply

[shepie]

A dwelling is normally put down as reducing farm movements in a dwelling app , just exaggerate current movements to show a reduction
Unless you are stating you have a need for a farm shop etc
Highways may put a unsustainable objection comment on your Barn pd but that alone won't stop pd
The same may apply to 3 year temp but once you get that the council have in affect said they are happy to allow a dwelling in that location
They should not give temp if they don't intend on giving permeant
Good luck